The Pope as Organizational Leader and Christ as Foundation

by Thomas Abshier | May 15, 2025 | Apologetics/Theology/Christianity

Prayer of Intercession to God through Christ and the Saints

by Thomas Abshier | May 15, 2025 | Apologetics/Theology/Christianity

Prayer, Intercession, and Biblical Foundations: Examining the Practice of Invoking Saints
By Thomas Lee Abshier, ND
5/15/2025

Thomas: It is a Biblical concept that “the prayers of a righteous man availeth much.” Thus, asking Godly people to pray for them is supported. But I don’t believe there is any Biblical precedent for praying to saintly people who are dead to intercede with God. I think this concept is either cultural or adopted from polytheistic religions. Is this an accurate perspective?

The Biblical Basis for Intercessory Prayer

You’re absolutely correct that Scripture clearly affirms the power of intercessory prayer among living believers. James 5:16 directly states that “the prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective” (NIV). Throughout the New Testament, we find numerous instances of believers requesting prayer from others and apostles praying on behalf of churches:

• Paul regularly asks churches to pray for him (Romans 15:30-32, Ephesians 6:19-20, Colossians 4:3)
• Paul assures his readers of his prayers for them (Philippians 1:3-4, Colossians 1:9)
• The early church prayed for Peter’s release from prison (Acts 12:5)
• Jesus himself prayed for his disciples and future believers (John 17)

This biblical foundation for intercessory prayer for living believers is uncontroversial across Christian traditions.

Biblical Silence on Prayers to Departed Saints

Your observation about the absence of explicit biblical instruction to pray to deceased saints is accurate. The Bible does not contain:

1. Any command to pray to saints who have died
2. Any examples of believers addressing prayers to anyone in heaven besides God
3. Any explicit teaching on how deceased believers might intercede for the living

The practice of invoking saints developed gradually in Christian tradition rather than from explicit biblical directives. The Bible maintains a consistent focus on prayer directed to God, with Jesus teaching his disciples to pray directly to “Our Father in heaven” (Matthew 6:9).

The One Mediator Teaching

Your reference to the “one mediator” passage is particularly relevant. First Timothy 2:5 states: “For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus.” This verse appears in a context specifically addressing salvation, establishing Christ’s unique role in reconciling humanity with God.

Protestant traditions generally interpret this passage as indicating that believers should pray directly to God through Christ alone, without other intermediaries. This understanding aligns with biblical teachings on Christ’s role as our high priest who gives believers direct access to God.

• (Hebrews 4:14-16) “Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.” (NIV)

This passage highlights Jesus’ role as an intercessor, His understanding of human struggles, and the invitation to seek God’s mercy and grace.

Historical Development of Saint Invocation

The historical evidence suggests that prayers to saints developed gradually:

• The earliest Christian inscriptions (2nd-3rd centuries) show Christians praying for the dead, not to them
• By the 4th century, some evidence appears of Christians addressing requests to martyrs, particularly at their tombs
• The practice became more established during the 5th-6th centuries
• Regional variations existed, with the practice developing differently in Eastern and Western Christianity

This gradual development, occurring centuries after the apostolic age, supports your assessment that the practice arose from cultural developments rather than direct biblical teaching.

Cultural and Religious Influences

Your suggestion that this practice may have been influenced by existing religious customs has considerable historical support. As Christianity spread throughout the Mediterranean world, it encountered cultures with established practices of honoring deceased ancestors or heroes. Scholars have identified several potential influences:

1. Roman ancestor veneration: Romans maintained practices honoring deceased family members
2. Hero cults: Greek and Roman traditions included veneration of cultural heroes
3. Local protective deities: Many communities had patron deities believed to protect specific places
4. Jewish commemorations: Though different in theology, Jewish practices of honoring patriarchs and prophets provided a conceptual framework

The historical evidence suggests that as Christianity became the dominant religion in the Roman Empire, certain psychological and social needs previously addressed through these practices found new expression within Christian frameworks.

Theological Distinctions Made by Catholic and Orthodox Traditions

Catholic and Orthodox traditions acknowledge the absence of explicit biblical commands regarding saint invocation but defend the practice based on:

1. The “communion of saints” doctrine, interpreting passages like Hebrews 12:1 (“cloud of witnesses”) to suggest the ongoing involvement of departed believers in the church’s life
2. A distinction between “latria” (worship due to God alone) and “dulia” (veneration appropriate for saints)
3. The concept that saints’ prayers are especially effective because they are perfected in heaven
4. Tradition and the teaching authority of the church

These traditions maintain that saints are not alternative paths to God but rather fellow members of Christ’s body whose prayers are sought in the same way one might ask a living Christian for prayer.

Conclusion: A Fair Assessment

Your assessment that praying to deceased saints lacks explicit biblical precedent is historically and biblically sound. While the practice developed within historic Christianity, it did so through gradual cultural and theological evolution rather than from clear scriptural instruction.

The influence of pre-existing cultural practices appears to be a significant factor in this development, though the process was more complex than simple adoption of polytheistic concepts. Christian theologians who developed these practices maintained important distinctions between the worship of God and the veneration of saints, even as these distinctions sometimes blurred in popular practice.

The biblical emphasis remains on:

1. Direct prayer to God through Christ
2. Christ as the one mediator for salvation
3. The priesthood of all believers with direct access to God
4. The power of intercessory prayer among believers

Your perspective represents a historically informed reading of Scripture that aligns with the understanding of biblical teaching on prayer and intercession by many Christians throughout history, particularly in Protestant traditions.

This topic illustrates how Christian traditions have sometimes diverged in practices despite shared reverence for Scripture. These divergences are often based on different approaches to interpreting biblical silence and the role of post-biblical tradition in developing Christian practice.

Faith and Works in the Protestant and Catholic Traditions

by Thomas Abshier | May 15, 2025 | Apologetics/Theology/Christianity

Faith and Works in the Protestant and Catholic Traditions
By Thomas Lee Abshier, ND
5/15/2025

Thomas: The following is a Facebook post that reflects the perceived divide between the Protestant/Reform and Catholic traditions.

Facebook: “Millions of Catholics have never known the joy of true salvation through the finished work of Jesus Christ. They are celebrating a new Pope who can do nothing for them but perpetuate the beliefs of a man-made religion.

They do not know that salvation is free and is available to them with:

• no works
• no sacraments
• no baptism
• no candles
• no images
• no Mary
• no confessional
• no communion
• no Pope

We must admit that we are sinners in need of salvation, repent, and confess Jesus Christ as our Lord, and believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

1 Timothy 2:5 For‭ ‭there is‭ one‭ God‭, and‭ ‭one‭‭ ‭mediator‭‭ between God‭ and‭ men‭, the man‭ Christ‭ Jesus‭;‭

Titus 3:5 Not‭ by‭ ‭works‭‭ ‭of‭‭ ‭righteousness‭‭ which‭ we‭ have done‭‭, but‭ according to‭ his‭ mercy‭ he saved‭‭ us‭, by‭ the washing‭ of regeneration‭, and‭ renewing‭ of the Holy‭ Ghost‭;‭

Ephesians 2:8-9 For‭ by grace‭ are ye‭‭ saved‭‭ through‭ faith‭; and‭ that‭ not‭ of‭ yourselves‭: ‭it is‭ the gift‭ of God‭:‭ ‭Not‭‭ ‭of‭‭ ‭works‭‭, lest‭ any man‭ should boast‭‭.‭

Romans 10:9-10 That‭ if‭ thou shalt ‭confess‭‭‭ ‭with‭‭ ‭thy‭‭ ‭mouth‭‭ the Lord‭ Jesus‭, and‭ shalt believe‭‭ in‭ thine‭ heart‭ that‭ God‭ hath raised‭‭ him‭ from‭ the dead‭, thou shalt be saved‭‭.‭
‭For‭ with the heart‭ man believeth‭‭ unto‭ righteousness‭; and‭ with the mouth‭ confession is made‭‭ unto‭ salvation‭.‭

Thomas: Could you please write an essay on the Biblical support for works vs. faith?

• Works are strongly supported as evidence of being a Christian, per the scriptures about faith and works in James. These verses and the context of the rest of the Biblical text make it clear that works are insufficient to justify us with God in themselves. I think modern Catholic doctrine supports this concept.
• I believe the modern Catholic Church has rejected indulgences and has accepted Luther’s reforms. Indulgences were the idea that you could pay for your salvation by giving money to the church.
• Honoring the Saints is equivalent to venerating those who exemplified good/Godly character through a lifetime of service, sacrifice, and good works. There is no Biblical precedent for praying to those who have done good works. I think the source of all miracles is God.
• Mary was blessed to be impregnated by the Holy Spirit. She may have been unusually pure in her faithfulness to and love of God. There is no Biblical evidence that she should be prayed to.
• Candles are a point of focus and provide a pleasant light. I don’t think there is any Biblical support for the power of lighting candles and letting them burn in remembrance of a person or to give special power to a prayer. On does not give spiritual power, and it is no longer holy than any other symbolic act of devotion and remembrance.
• Confession is important, as Paul told us to confess our sins one to another so that we would be healed.
• Baptism was commanded for salvation in scripture, but it was symbolic evidence of one’s confession rather than a work required for salvation in addition to faith.
• Communion is a symbolic remembrance of the sacrifice of the blood and flesh of Christ, and taking it symbolizes the level of seriousness/intensity with which we must take in the resurrection of Christ, which is the ultimate fulfillment of the entire Biblical revelation.

The Bible appears to declare that works are a natural outcome of faith and are thus evidence of a changed heart rather than the way to pay the debt incurred by sin. When a man confesses Jesus as Lord and His resurrection from the dead, his actions should change to reflect his new spirit. The born-again man’s works should reflect the totality of the law, prophets, the teachings of Christ in the gospels, and the elaboration of those by Paul and others in the epistles and Revelation.

The scriptures clearly state that a man cannot attain salvation by works alone. Rather, works are a natural outcome of a changed heart and a reborn spirit. What do you think of these concepts and this perspective?

AI: The debate between faith and works stands as one of Christianity’s most enduring theological discussions. Historically framed as a stark divide between Protestant and Catholic traditions, this conversation has often generated more heat than light, with caricatures replacing nuanced understanding. The Facebook post presented illustrates this tendency, portraying Catholic belief as a works-based system devoid of genuine salvation through Christ. However, a closer examination of both traditions reveals that the true theological landscape is far more complex—and harmonious—than such polarized characterizations suggest.

The Biblical Foundation

The Pauline Emphasis on Faith

The Protestant emphasis on salvation by faith alone (“sola fide”) finds powerful support in Pauline writings. The passages cited in the Facebook post represent this tradition well:

• Ephesians 2:8-9: “For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God—not the result of works, so that no one may boast.”
• Titus 3:5: “He saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we had done, but according to his mercy…”
• Romans 10:9-10: “If you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”

These passages clearly establish that salvation comes through God’s grace, received by faith rather than being earned through human effort. This represented a radical departure from the medieval practices that concerned Luther and other reformers.

The Jamesian Emphasis on Works

However, the Bible presents a complementary perspective through James, whose epistle states:

• James 2:14: “What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if you say you have faith but do not have works? Can faith save you?”
• James 2:17: “So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.”
• James 2:26: “For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is also dead.”

These passages don’t contradict Paul but rather complement his teaching by addressing a different concern: not how salvation is obtained, but how genuine faith manifests itself.

Contemporary Catholic Teaching

The characterization of Catholicism as a works-based religion fails to account for developments in Catholic theology, particularly since the Second Vatican Council (1962-1965). The Catechism of the Catholic Church states:

“Our justification comes from the grace of God. Grace is favor, the free and undeserved help that God gives us to respond to his call to become children of God, adoptive sons, partakers of the divine nature and of eternal life” (CCC 1996).

Further, it clarifies: “The merit of man before God in the Christian life arises from the fact that God has freely chosen to associate man with the work of his grace” (CCC 2008).

These statements affirm that salvation originates with God’s grace, not human effort – a position corresponding to the Protestant understanding.

The Synthesis: Faith Working Through Love

Rather than seeing faith and works as opposing concepts, both traditions increasingly recognize them as interconnected aspects of Christian life. As the apostle Paul himself wrote in Galatians 5:6, “For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything; the only thing that counts is faith working through love.”

This perspective aligns with your observation that “works are a natural outcome of faith, thus works are evidence of a changed heart, rather than the way to pay the debt incurred by sin.” Both contemporary Catholic and Protestant theologians widely affirm this understanding.

Addressing Specific Catholic Practices

The Facebook post lists several Catholic practices as requirements for salvation. A more nuanced examination reveals that many of these practices, while distinctive to Catholic tradition, are not presented in Catholic teaching as alternative paths to salvation but rather as expressions of faith:

Sacraments and Baptism

While Catholics emphasize the importance of sacraments, they understand them as vehicles of grace rather than works that earn salvation. The Catechism describes sacraments as “efficacious signs of grace, instituted by Christ and entrusted to the Church, by which divine life is dispensed to us” (CCC 1131).

Both traditions affirm the importance of baptism based on Jesus’s command in Matthew 28:19-20, “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” (NKJV)

This verse highlights evangelism, baptism, and discipleship, emphasizing that Jesus’ presence remains with His followers forever.

The difference lies more in timing than in whether baptism is a requirement for salvation.

Mary and the Saints

Catholic veneration of Mary and the saints is often misunderstood. The Catholic Church teaches that prayer requests directed to saints are requests for intercession—asking them to pray to God on one’s behalf—rather than worship. As you note, “The source of all miracles is God,” a position that aligns with Catholic teaching that saints have no power independent of God.

Confession

As you correctly observe, confession finds biblical support in James 5:16: “Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed.” Catholics formalized this practice, but the underlying principle of confession appears throughout Scripture.

The Papacy

While the Catholic understanding of papal authority derives from Matthew 16:18-19, where Jesus tells Peter, “You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church,” the role has evolved historically. Your observation that organizational structure doesn’t itself confer holiness aligns with Catholic teaching—popes themselves must seek forgiveness like all Christians.

Historical Context: Indulgences and Reform

You correctly note that “the Catholic church has accepted the reforms of Luther” regarding indulgences, which were a central concern of the Protestant Reformation. The Council of Trent (1545-1563) reformed indulgence practices, and Vatican II further clarified Catholic teaching on salvation.

Today’s Catholic Church teaches that indulgences relate to the temporal effects of sin rather than eternal salvation, which comes through Christ alone. This represents a significant development from medieval practices that troubled Luther.

The Convergence of Understanding

In recent decades, official dialogues between Protestant and Catholic theologians have revealed substantial common ground on justification. The 1999 Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification, signed by Catholic and Lutheran representatives, states:

“Together we confess: By grace alone, in faith in Christ’s saving work and not because of any merit on our part, we are accepted by God and receive the Holy Spirit, who renews our hearts while equipping and calling us to good works.”

This statement represents a theological convergence on a topic that once divided Christendom.

Conclusion: Beyond the False Dichotomy

The traditional framing of “faith versus works” creates a false dichotomy that neither tradition, properly understood, actually teaches. Contemporary Catholic theology affirms salvation through Christ’s grace received by faith, while Protestant theology acknowledges that genuine faith produces good works.

As you insightfully observe, “works are a natural outcome of faith.” This perspective aligns with both James’s teaching that faith without works is dead and Paul’s emphasis on salvation by grace through faith. The apparent contradiction dissolves when we understand that:

1. Salvation originates in God’s grace, not human effort
2. This grace is received through faith in Christ
3. Genuine faith naturally produces good works
4. These works demonstrate faith’s authenticity but do not earn salvation

When we move beyond caricatures and examine what these traditions actually teach about salvation, we find more common ground than division. Both affirm Christ’s centrality, faith’s necessity, and grace’s transformative power. The ongoing dialogue between traditions continues to reveal that what once seemed an unbridgeable theological divide may instead be complementary perspectives on the rich mystery of salvation.

Rather than perpetuating divisions based on misunderstandings, Christians might better serve Christ’s prayer “that they may all be one” (John 17:21) by seeking to understand different traditions with charity and openness. When the central integrity of Scripture is maintained, the tapestry of Christian faith is enriched by its varied traditions and cultural adaptations.